Comments on: A Compact for the Century http://www.rvtradedigest.com/interactive/2006/10/23/a-compact-for-the-century/ Welcome to RV Weekly where the editor of RV Trade Digest will be updating you on the latest news, trends, and products important to the RV industry. Fri, 21 Nov 2008 00:22:45 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.3.3 By: YoYo http://www.rvtradedigest.com/interactive/2006/10/23/a-compact-for-the-century/#comment-140 YoYo Tue, 21 Nov 2006 22:31:37 +0000 http://www.rvtradedigest.com/interactive/2006/10/23/a-compact-for-the-century/#comment-140 What a foolish article. Sounds like you read a page or two of a franchise agreement and thought yourself educated to comment. I can deduce, however, that you haven't a clue as to the intimacies of the program or the habits of RV salespeople in general. Take a consensus of participating dealer's and their feelings toward the program. Dealer profitability has risen exponentially and sales have gone to a manufacturer with an infrastructure sufficient to support its customer base with reputable customer service. In a market where the average buyer is getting younger and younger, and sales are weighted more on aesthetics than qulaity and service, it is refreshing to see unassuming customers "lured" to a manufacturer that will leave them pleased and coming back for more in the long run. Is retention not what this indutry needs? I guess I am missing the travesty of which you refer to in your "educated" opine. What a foolish article. Sounds like you read a page or two of a franchise agreement and thought yourself educated to comment. I can deduce, however, that you haven’t a clue as to the intimacies of the program or the habits of RV salespeople in general.
Take a consensus of participating dealer’s and their feelings toward the program. Dealer profitability has risen exponentially and sales have gone to a manufacturer with an infrastructure sufficient to support its customer base with reputable customer service.

In a market where the average buyer is getting younger and younger, and sales are weighted more on aesthetics than qulaity and service, it is refreshing to see unassuming customers “lured” to a manufacturer that will leave them pleased and coming back for more in the long run. Is retention not what this indutry needs?

I guess I am missing the travesty of which you refer to in your “educated” opine.

]]> By: Lindsey http://www.rvtradedigest.com/interactive/2006/10/23/a-compact-for-the-century/#comment-61 Lindsey Mon, 30 Oct 2006 17:40:03 +0000 http://www.rvtradedigest.com/interactive/2006/10/23/a-compact-for-the-century/#comment-61 As a dealer in a state where all dealer agreements ammount to franchise agreements.albeit they are slanted in the dealers favor.While I beleive that the rhetoric currantly will prove to be successful in the distant future right now as pointed out by earlier comments They (Monaco)are not exactly an honest broker in the deal.Nor are any RV manufactors that I know of I only have 16 years in this game.Spiffs are not the problem neither is a dealer hold back or an advertising allowence.The problem is the fact that at month end or quarter end or some other excuse favored dealers are offered substantal discounts on perfectly good product giving them a definate compettive edge over other dealers this short sighted way of doing business weakens the value of the franchise and causes dealers to doubt the effectiveness of the program. Monaco suffers from the same short sightedness as the rest of the manufactors in that they look at the dealer as their ultimate customer when in fact the ultimate customer is the retail buyer.they will listen when it comes to fetures and floor plans but that is it.while this is 90% of the deal the rest comes from large scale issues like quality and customer satisfaction and continuity of price.while msrp is pretty close nation wide actual dealer price varries by several thousand dollars.To correct this problem all incentives need to move from the wholesale to the retail customer in the form of rebates and or dealer cash insentives based on actual sales not whole sale purchaces will leavel the playing field and make a franchise more valueable and exclusive.this would also allow and encourage more trading between dealers and make it easier to move older product.Until munufactors stop treating us dealers like reail "ups" with their offers of "if i can get you 10grand off will you buy it today"then the franchise will not have any real value to it As a dealer in a state where all dealer agreements ammount to franchise agreements.albeit they are slanted in the dealers favor.While I beleive that the rhetoric currantly will prove to be successful in the distant future right now as pointed out by earlier comments They (Monaco)are not exactly an honest broker in the deal.Nor are any RV manufactors that I know of I only have 16 years in this game.Spiffs are not the problem neither is a dealer hold back or an advertising allowence.The problem is the fact that at month end or quarter end or some other excuse favored dealers are offered substantal discounts on perfectly good product giving them a definate compettive edge over other dealers this short sighted way of doing business weakens the value of the franchise and causes dealers to doubt the effectiveness of the program.
Monaco suffers from the same short sightedness as the rest of the manufactors in that they look at the dealer as their ultimate customer when in fact the ultimate customer is the retail buyer.they will listen when it comes to fetures and floor plans but that is it.while this is 90% of the deal the rest comes from large scale issues like quality and customer satisfaction and continuity of price.while msrp is pretty close nation wide actual dealer price varries by several thousand dollars.To correct this problem all incentives need to move from the wholesale to the retail customer in the form of rebates and or dealer cash insentives based on actual sales not whole sale purchaces will leavel the playing field and make a franchise more valueable and exclusive.this would also allow and encourage more trading between dealers and make it easier to move older product.Until munufactors stop treating us dealers like reail “ups” with their offers of “if i can get you 10grand off will you buy it today”then the franchise will not have any real value to it

]]> By: Foo man http://www.rvtradedigest.com/interactive/2006/10/23/a-compact-for-the-century/#comment-58 Foo man Sun, 29 Oct 2006 04:17:03 +0000 http://www.rvtradedigest.com/interactive/2006/10/23/a-compact-for-the-century/#comment-58 Quote"Realistically, let’s just allow manufacturers to stick to what they do best – assemble RVs – and let’s let dealers do what they do best – sell and fix the RVs. That way, each entity can be assured that its own employees are watching out for the business’s best interests because the business’s owner is the only one who writes the checks." Dealers do Sell Rvs - but fix them? Are you kidding? I think some dealers might actually have some intention of wanting to fix them, but I have yet to run in to one that actually does. Maybe [the franchise of the future's originator] will actually end up creating a business model that works as well for the consumer as the old one has for sellers - uh, I mean "dealers." Quote”Realistically, let’s just allow manufacturers to stick to what they do best – assemble RVs – and let’s let dealers do what they do best – sell and fix the RVs. That way, each entity can be assured that its own employees are watching out for the business’s best interests because the business’s owner is the only one who writes the checks.”

Dealers do Sell Rvs - but fix them? Are you kidding? I think some dealers might actually have some intention of wanting to fix them, but I have yet to run in to one that actually does.

Maybe [the franchise of the future’s originator]
will actually end up creating a business model that works as well for the consumer as the old one has for sellers - uh, I mean “dealers.”

]]> By: Dave http://www.rvtradedigest.com/interactive/2006/10/23/a-compact-for-the-century/#comment-54 Dave Fri, 27 Oct 2006 00:51:05 +0000 http://www.rvtradedigest.com/interactive/2006/10/23/a-compact-for-the-century/#comment-54 Your all Right! Just remember what goes around come's around. Use your head and don't let things get out of hand. If we all can make money no matter where it comes from and it does not hurt the dealerships bottom line or your customer CSI then I say let it ride after all we all need to earn a living. Your all Right! Just remember what goes around come’s around. Use your head and don’t let things get out of hand. If we all can make money no matter where it comes from and it does not hurt the dealerships bottom line or your customer CSI then I say let it ride after all we all need to earn a living.

]]> By: BD http://www.rvtradedigest.com/interactive/2006/10/23/a-compact-for-the-century/#comment-53 BD Thu, 26 Oct 2006 20:00:56 +0000 http://www.rvtradedigest.com/interactive/2006/10/23/a-compact-for-the-century/#comment-53 There are two problems with Greg's article: 1. It villifies OEM's by implying that this is a one sided issue, and 2. the hypothetical examples are just plain silly. I am a manager for an OEM to disclose my perspective, and I fully admit OEM's are not without sin on this issue. However, I think the sentiments expressed by Sales Man Extraordinaire (SME) exhibit why this is a problem and demonstrate much of what is wrong with this part of the business. I dislike the concept of spiffs, but we offer them from time to time because we receive requests from so many dealers. The implication is we will be at a competitive disadvantage if we don't offer a spiff program. The comment, "You want to make sure our salespeople are excited about selling your product" came with one such written request earlier this year. But the OEM's are driving this issue? SME made the comment: "Well, what incentive do I have to sell a RV that I know will make me less money even though the dealership wants to get rid of it?". Answer: It's your job. The dealer bought the unit and has tied up capital resourses and carrying costs associated with it being there too long. The customer buying that unit will be back for service, to buy parts, and maybe another new RV in a couple of years - all activities that drive revenue into the dealership. SME's boss has an obvious incentive/motivational problem. He is only focused on his commission for a particular sale and not the good of the dealership as a whole. This may be very understandable based on his compensation structure, which is the very issue the dealer needs to address. If dealers want to keep the "evil influence" of OEM spiffs out of their businesses, they need to take responsibility for motivating and providing proper financial incentives for their salespeople. At the OEM level, we hold our reps accountable for selling all of our models and moving non-current models at model change. We often have to offer additional discounts to move this product, which cuts our already thin margins. We do not ask our reps to take the hit. Perhaps dealers could do the same by reducing often excessive overhead packs and other internal charges on older units instead of simply cutting the gross on which the salepeople are paid. This may not follow the 20 Group profit maximization playbook, but it would move some stagnant units and keep product from aging. There are two problems with Greg’s article: 1. It villifies OEM’s by implying that this is a one sided issue, and 2. the hypothetical examples are just plain silly. I am a manager for an OEM to disclose my perspective, and I fully admit OEM’s are not without sin on this issue. However, I think the sentiments expressed by Sales Man Extraordinaire (SME) exhibit why this is a problem and demonstrate much of what is wrong with this part of the business. I dislike the concept of spiffs, but we offer them from time to time because we receive requests from so many dealers. The implication is we will be at a competitive disadvantage if we don’t offer a spiff program. The comment, “You want to make sure our salespeople are excited about selling your product” came with one such written request earlier this year. But the OEM’s are driving this issue?

SME made the comment: “Well, what incentive do I have to sell a RV that I know will make me less money even though the dealership wants to get rid of it?”. Answer: It’s your job. The dealer bought the unit and has tied up capital resourses and carrying costs associated with it being there too long. The customer buying that unit will be back for service, to buy parts, and maybe another new RV in a couple of years - all activities that drive revenue into the dealership. SME’s boss has an obvious incentive/motivational problem. He is only focused on his commission for a particular sale and not the good of the dealership as a whole. This may be very understandable based on his compensation structure, which is the very issue the dealer needs to address. If dealers want to keep the “evil influence” of OEM spiffs out of their businesses, they need to take responsibility for motivating and providing proper financial incentives for their salespeople.

At the OEM level, we hold our reps accountable for selling all of our models and moving non-current models at model change. We often have to offer additional discounts to move this product, which cuts our already thin margins. We do not ask our reps to take the hit. Perhaps dealers could do the same by reducing often excessive overhead packs and other internal charges on older units instead of simply cutting the gross on which the salepeople are paid. This may not follow the 20 Group profit maximization playbook, but it would move some stagnant units and keep product from aging.

]]> By: Ron Wood http://www.rvtradedigest.com/interactive/2006/10/23/a-compact-for-the-century/#comment-52 Ron Wood Thu, 26 Oct 2006 15:13:21 +0000 http://www.rvtradedigest.com/interactive/2006/10/23/a-compact-for-the-century/#comment-52 For most professional salesperson, it all begins with helping find our customers the right RV, not the the RV with the best sales spiff. Most manufacturer's spiff programs are given to bring attention to a new products, to refocus sales attention on older units, and usually given for a limited time. This makes spiffs hard to track, hence; are often not told to new & existing salespeople till after the sale. In the overall sceme of thing, spiffs are viewed as an added bonus for a job well done, or a way to earn a living at those dealerships that "pencil back" a sales person's commission through excessive dealer packs and add on's. For most professional salesperson, it all begins with helping find our customers the right RV, not the the RV with the best sales spiff. Most manufacturer’s spiff programs are given to bring attention to a new products, to refocus sales attention on older units, and usually given for a limited time. This makes spiffs hard to track, hence; are often not told to new & existing salespeople till after the sale. In the overall sceme of thing, spiffs are viewed as an added bonus for a job well done, or a way to earn a living at those dealerships that “pencil back” a sales person’s commission through excessive dealer packs and add on’s.

]]> By: frank http://www.rvtradedigest.com/interactive/2006/10/23/a-compact-for-the-century/#comment-51 frank Thu, 26 Oct 2006 00:00:25 +0000 http://www.rvtradedigest.com/interactive/2006/10/23/a-compact-for-the-century/#comment-51 Good morning greg Well I need to tell you how taken back I was by knowing that you would publish something like this. I have been in the industry for over 28 years and selling 10 million plus dollars a year wholesale.The word spiff has been around since I started.I have been paid spiffs by many of manufactures for a long time.Monaco is the only one that has put in writting as a dealer agreement.Please keep in mind that auto industry has been doing this forever. Dealer hold back and spiffs for the sales team.How about other companys that pay spiffs ? gulfstream,Fleetwood,nu wa,Alpine coach,Forest river to list several.Almost every rv manufacture pays spiffs.Even workhorse and ford have a chassis spiff program.Does that meen I will try to sell them befor another one. NO... If you are in the industry for the long haul you can never survive by selling customers the units that only pay spiffs.You will starve!! If you do your job and listen to the customers wants and needs you will guide them to the coach that best fits their needs.With the internet now letting some dealers try to blow units out for invoice outside there market area. At least we the sales rep can still make a living and feed our familys with the help of franchise to the future.I will tell you that they are the #1 in diesel sales and I am proud to repersent their line of luxuary coaches.Maybe you should come aboard and try to sell for a while.They say they who sell are salesmen and those who can not train. Thanks again Good morning greg

Well I need to tell you how taken back I was by knowing that you would publish something like this. I have been in the industry for over 28 years and selling 10 million plus dollars a year wholesale.The word spiff has been around since I started.I have been paid spiffs by many of manufactures for a long time.Monaco is the only one that has put in writting as a dealer agreement.Please keep in mind that auto industry has been doing this forever. Dealer hold back and spiffs for the sales team.How about other companys that pay spiffs ? gulfstream,Fleetwood,nu wa,Alpine coach,Forest river to list several.Almost every rv manufacture pays spiffs.Even workhorse and ford have a chassis spiff program.Does that meen I will try to sell them befor another one. NO… If you are in the industry for the long haul you can never survive by selling customers the units that only pay spiffs.You will starve!! If you do your job and listen to the customers wants and needs you will guide them to the coach that best fits their needs.With the internet now letting some dealers try to blow units out for invoice outside there market area. At least we the sales rep can still make a living and feed our familys with the help of franchise to the future.I will tell you that they are the #1 in diesel sales and I am proud to repersent their line of luxuary coaches.Maybe you should come aboard and try to sell for a while.They say they who sell are salesmen and those who can not train. Thanks again

]]> By: johnny bishop http://www.rvtradedigest.com/interactive/2006/10/23/a-compact-for-the-century/#comment-47 johnny bishop Wed, 25 Oct 2006 17:37:03 +0000 http://www.rvtradedigest.com/interactive/2006/10/23/a-compact-for-the-century/#comment-47 You have hit a hot button with me on this item. I have been a Dealer for this OEM for several years, but am going out when I retail this last one on my lot. They blew me away with all the smoke/mirrors when this program came out at vegas a couple years ago. At first blush it sounds good. Then comes the fine print....Our oldest OEM is and has been our sales leader, and I have no intention of changing that. Plus, this mystery Shopper program, where they hire some plug, who couldnt afford a wheel off a motorhome, and send them to your lot to pester a sales person trying to make a sale(and getting one of these bums)for a :"UP" We dont need or want that on this lot. And you are right, what if all the others have to start greasing the sales person? When does it stop ? You lose all control over your own business. You have hit a hot button with me on this item. I have
been a Dealer for this OEM for several years, but am going
out when I retail this last one on my lot. They blew me
away with all the smoke/mirrors when this program came out
at vegas a couple years ago. At first blush it sounds good. Then comes the fine print….Our oldest OEM is and
has been our sales leader, and I have no intention of changing that. Plus, this mystery Shopper program, where
they hire some plug, who couldnt afford a wheel off a motorhome, and send them to your lot to pester a sales person trying to make a sale(and getting one of these bums)for a :”UP” We dont need or want that on this lot.
And you are right, what if all the others have to start
greasing the sales person? When does it stop ? You lose all control over your own business.

]]> By: Sales Man Extraordinaire http://www.rvtradedigest.com/interactive/2006/10/23/a-compact-for-the-century/#comment-46 Sales Man Extraordinaire Wed, 25 Oct 2006 15:22:03 +0000 http://www.rvtradedigest.com/interactive/2006/10/23/a-compact-for-the-century/#comment-46 Why do manufacturers issue these spiffs? They issue them because their product is lacking something. In order for them to sell, they have to make up for it. Maybe it is old inventory, maybe it lacks features, or maybe it lacks a price point. In any event you usually do not have large general spiffs across the board from a company that makes solid products at good prices. Some companies may intice you with a hundred dollar spiff across the board, but you can usually expect to make a little less to begin with on those types of products, and the hundred dollar spiff helps make up for it. They lack a good price point for the features they offer. In addition, if it is old inventory, then you are usually taking a smaller profit margin. Well, what incentive do I have to sell a RV that I know will make me less money even though the dealership wants to get rid of it? The answer is a spiff. Furthermore, if the manufacturer is going to provide that for the dealer, then they are smart enough to realize that by helping to move the old unit, they will be able to bring in more new units. It works out in the end for everyone. Spiffs are not usually a way to buy a sales persons loyalty to that product. Why do manufacturers issue these spiffs? They issue them because their product is lacking something. In order for them to sell, they have to make up for it. Maybe it is old inventory, maybe it lacks features, or maybe it lacks a price point. In any event you usually do not have large general spiffs across the board from a company that makes solid products at good prices. Some companies may intice you with a hundred dollar spiff across the board, but you can usually expect to make a little less to begin with on those types of products, and the hundred dollar spiff helps make up for it. They lack a good price point for the features they offer. In addition, if it is old inventory, then you are usually taking a smaller profit margin. Well, what incentive do I have to sell a RV that I know will make me less money even though the dealership wants to get rid of it? The answer is a spiff. Furthermore, if the manufacturer is going to provide that for the dealer, then they are smart enough to realize that by helping to move the old unit, they will be able to bring in more new units. It works out in the end for everyone. Spiffs are not usually a way to buy a sales persons loyalty to that product.

]]> By: Bud http://www.rvtradedigest.com/interactive/2006/10/23/a-compact-for-the-century/#comment-45 Bud Wed, 25 Oct 2006 14:01:43 +0000 http://www.rvtradedigest.com/interactive/2006/10/23/a-compact-for-the-century/#comment-45 The Franchise for the future is a program we went into reluctantly. We still are a reluctant dealer. Not for the salesmen spiffs, but something bigger than that. The deals to some dealers and not others was supposed to stop. Well, I just got offered 10 grand off a certain model that this manufacturer makes last week. I spoke to another dealer in a different state, he did not get the same offer. The upper management of this company is not trustworthy and does not keep their word. The Franchise for the future is a program we went into reluctantly. We still are a reluctant dealer. Not for the salesmen spiffs, but something bigger than that. The deals to some dealers and not others was supposed to stop. Well, I just got offered 10 grand off a certain model that this manufacturer makes last week. I spoke to another dealer in a different state, he did not get the same offer. The upper management of this company is not trustworthy and does not keep their word.

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